Getting First Turn

[GreatGonzales]

So I'm frustrated. Of the last 12 games I've started, only 2 of them have been first turn. I'm just wondering, what have people found to be the best way of avoiding this problem? Currently I've been starting a game here, a game there. I know someone suggested that I start a bunch of games in a row...I've just started 2, both second turn against two different people. Should I start a few more? Are my odds good?

Probably, there is no answer to this. In which case, consider this thread catharsis.

[blckace]

Start a game when everyone else is sleeping, pretty sure you'd get first turn

[Da Wizerd]

It's very dependent on the time of day, which will depend on where you live, early afternoon tends to work well for me, im in eastern standard time. if you start one and get player 2, it's usually best to wait and try again a while later, you need to catch the server when it's out of people waiting for matches in your skill range.

[Syvan]

You need to enter a clear queue, which means sampling the queue a couple times every once in a while. If you get first turn, you should be clear to blast the rest of your available games as player one. I personally don't like abusing the queue, but I don't hold anything against you if you do. The technique works better the higher your level, I think you are in the top 50? If so you should be able to eventually find a clear queue.

[worldfamous]

I've never had more than 3 in a row as P2. Spam away and you'll get your fair share.

[Emuchu]

Especially in the higher leagues, people like to spam the queue in order to avoid being second player. As much as it pains me to admit it, playing second carries a distinct disadvantage, especially in maps like Long Nine and Foundry that are too humongous to adequately defend that early.

But fear not! Alex started an open call for beta testers for an upcoming patch, which contains, among other things, possible tweaks to address first-turn advantage. Hopefully, when FTA isn't as big of a deal (I think the last community tourney estimated it at around 2.5:1?), people won't feel as compelled to resort to stacking the deck, so to speak.

In the mean time, be very wary of people stacking the queue. I usually sample it two games at a time, and if I don't get matched to the same guy twice in a row, I'll start some more games up.

Although, I die a little on the inside every time I have to play Long Nine and Foundry as P2. It's almost impossible to win the latter against a competent player, I think.

[garcia1000]

How would you guys rank the magnitude of the first turn advantage on the maps?

Here's my ranking, from LEAST to MOST advantage. * represents a unit of advantage.

Peekaboo *
Sweetie Plains **
Sharkfood Island ***
Long Nine ***
Glitch ****
Foundry *************

[Emuchu]

I'd put Foundry at the top as "nearly unwinnable" at high level. Player 2 is almost guaranteed to lose his Sniper on Turn 3, unless Player 1 is rushing the back door, in which case Player 2 gets royally screwed if he decided to protect his Sniper during Turn 2. 50/50 is not cool. I'm in Masters, Rank 7, and I've never lost on the Foundry as Player 1.

Long Nine I'd rank second as "pretty BS". Player 2 will always lose his Sniper in this map, as well, unless he spends the Wits to move the Medic over there, or he retreats it, which is wasteful. Meanwhile, Player 1 will take advantage of these wasted points to either wage a Runner war for the Northern ?+ Space or rush South, and Player 2 typically only has the resources to adequately defend one side or the other, especially with the Spawn points as far back as they are. What REALLY grinds my gears, though, is that Long Nine remains the only map where, even at high level play, Player 1 can still get away with pulling a Runner Rush.

As for the other maps, I can usually put up a decent defense as Player 2 in Sweetie Plains (my favorite map), Glitch (surprisingly fun map, since you can usually see pretty well), and Long Nine (it's tough, but I've never felt like I don't stand a chance).

As for Peekaboo... I'm on the fence on that map. The ?+ Space is difficult to defend as it is as Player 2, and whenever I play second, Player 1 always sets up a doggone Bombshell early. I'm not sure, though, if my games here are more influenced by FTA or just by virtue of this being a poor map to try and fight against a Bombshell in.

[garcia1000]

huh. I've never lost to runner rush on long nine or have someone win with that.
Pro tip! As 2P on Long Nine, take the bottom wit space with a spawned runner, and boost your sniper.

[aaronINdayton]

(09-28-2012 06:27 PM)garcia1000 Wrote:  How would you guys rank the magnitude of the first turn advantage on the maps?

Here's my ranking, from LEAST to MOST advantage. * represents a unit of advantage.

Peekaboo *
Sweetie Plains **
Sharkfood Island ***
Long Nine ***
Glitch ****
Foundry *************

I've founds sweetie plains super easy/hard based on FTA, I seem to easily win or struggle greatly depending on who starts the game. I'd put it at a bigger advantage than Long Nine from my experience.