Diamond 24 - 12 Good Game [GG Clan Tourney]

[jesusfuentesh]

Your attention please:

- The point discount for delay in a turn applies only once and is just related to the match. But if someone lets the match say the maximun time limt (3 days) three times, it'll be considered a forfeit. The opponent has to post screenshots on the thread each time it occurs.
- Remember, if the match got say 4 days, it'll be considered a forfeit at once.

Thanks for your suggestions.

[Thrutchy]

If he waits one more day, the game will be forfeit according to the rules. The rules seem reasonable to me. If you guys had an issue with the time limit rules, it should have been brought up before the games started, not in the middle of the tournament. jesusfuentesh seems to be running the tournament very smoothly and I'm sure it is a lot of work keeping up with it. Please don't pester him to change the rules in the middle like what happened in the last world cup.

[[PETA] Cor13:4]

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(08-28-2013 11:52 PM)Harti Wrote:  On a related note, when I used to play Advance Wars competitively back in the day, this kind of stalling has always been abused blatantly by the better players. They used to push everything to the max so that they just don't forfeit their match. If they were close to getting booted from a game, they activated the "on vacation" flag that granted them 14 more days to stall.

A high-level game of 20 "days" (i.e. 40 turns) took about 6 months this way. It was not only unsporting since you had to jot down your tactical ideas somewhere in order not to forget them; it wasn't really "fun" either.

Living through the deja-vu here makes me really upset because I know my guys: They're super friendly, play for fun and are eager to get games done as quickly as possible.

From my point of view, your current ruleset doesn't punish stalling enough. While you're saying that they should take "two days at maximum" (!) you'll just discount points until it's 0 points. What's the point in keeping on with the match if it gives 0 points? The most the opposing team can do is to prevent the other team from getting any points (while still permanently breaking the 2-day rule). I can't believe that this kind of rulesharking is allowed in this tournament that is meant to be "fun" for everybody.


Sorry to jump into the discussion this way, but as I said before it makes me tremendously upset to experience that very same cocky attitude the competitive Advance Wars players used to have in Outwitters now.

Plus, I don't think they are doing this because they are losing, or are intentionally stalling. I don't think "Outwitters" has gotten to that point. They probably are just busy, aren't they brothers?

[amoffett11]

I'm sure that it is because he's just busy. (Note: I read this back to myself, and it sounded sarcastic. It is not. I am actually pretty sure that he's just busy, as the matches have only just started and I doubt he's decided that it's already necessary to start stalling).

However, I don't think the issue here is about changing the rules, I think its about the interpretation of the rules. The confusion arises from the phrase "1 point will be discounted". There is no indication that points would only be discounted in the event of a win by the offending player. I think the concern is that if a player realizes he's going to lose anyways, the time limit rule can just be thrown out the window. We are are not suggesting that the rules be changed, we just hope they are enforced, and hopefully not abused. Diamond League is working hard to keep up with our turns, and we hope everyone else does also; we all want this tournament to be a success.

Quote:If he waits one more day, the game will be forfeit according to the rules. The rules seem reasonable to me. If you guys had an issue with the time limit rules, it should have been brought up before the games started, not in the middle of the tournament. jesusfuentesh seems to be running the tournament very smoothly and I'm sure it is a lot of work keeping up with it. Please don't pester him to change the rules in the middle like what happened in the last world cup.

I think you need to back up just a tad. No one is "pestering" anyone.

[Thrutchy]

Rule changes in the middle of a competition can be destructive. Take a look at what happened in the last World Cup in the middle of the qualifiers when a few ST's didn't qualify. Some were asking for a rule change, then there was a rule change, then others saw that rule change as harming their chances, and then a compromise was settled on. All of this was probably not good for the tournament.

In this case, you are probably right. This seems like just a clarification of the rules, since it wasn't clear what would happen when the lower time limit was hit multiple times.

[=) Random Task (=]

I dont think we have a case of abuse here. It can happen that a game gets overlooked in the queue if you are busy. I think jesusfuentes has dealt with the situation by clarifying the rule so that it is clear enough. Lets carry on and have fun!

[Harti]

(08-29-2013 01:44 AM)Thrutchy Wrote:  Rule changes in the middle of a competition can be destructive.

I do agree. I have points against this but I don't want to argue against this at all.


My post solely aimed to give food for thought; both for upcoming tournaments as well as - if they did stall (I only questioned it, I didn't judge nor suggest, or even have a look at the player names) - players that may have a tendency to stall.

I know GreatGonzales and the RawkHawk (always making me think of my favorite NGC game ) as active and fair players, however, so I would like to apologize for jumping the gun. Still I believe that, if you don't have the perfect answer to a turn at first glance, and also not on the second, you might want to procrastinate. I've been there before. Not only in Advance Wars or other strategy games - but also in real life. I consider this a natural thing and the only thing I suggest is that there may be a possibility that procrastination is what's happening here.


In the end of the day, Gonzales or not, RawkHawk or not, my point still stands: If the rules say that you "should please please not take longer than 2 days", people in the tournament should stick with it for fairness' sake, no matter the reason. In exceptional cases it should be allowed with notice beforehand, but I can't think of any other life situation causing you not to have the 20 minutes before going to bed.

[His_Daddy]

Iphone or Ipad died

(08-29-2013 04:53 AM)Harti Wrote:  

(08-29-2013 01:44 AM)Thrutchy Wrote:  Rule changes in the middle of a competition can be destructive.

I do agree. I have points against this but I don't want to argue against this at all.


My post solely aimed to give food for thought; both for upcoming tournaments as well as - if they did stall (I only questioned it, I didn't judge nor suggest, or even have a look at the player names) - players that may have a tendency to stall.

I know GreatGonzales and the RawkHawk (always making me think of my favorite NGC game ) as active and fair players, however, so I would like to apologize for jumping the gun. Still I believe that, if you don't have the perfect answer to a turn at first glance, and also not on the second, you might want to procrastinate. I've been there before. Not only in Advance Wars or other strategy games - but also in real life. I consider this a natural thing and the only thing I suggest is that there may be a possibility that procrastination is what's happening here.


In the end of the day, Gonzales or not, RawkHawk or not, my point still stands: If the rules say that you "should please please not take longer than 2 days", people in the tournament should stick with it for fairness' sake, no matter the reason. In exceptional cases it should be allowed with notice beforehand, but I can't think of any other life situation causing you not to have the 20 minutes before going to bed.

[lawtai]

outwitters://viewgame?id=ahRzfm91dHdpdHRlcnNnYW1lLWhyZHIVCxIIR2FtZVJvb20YgICAgKCgkAoM

Good game!

[.Memories.]