10 reasons why I switched to new Bramble

[burnodrod]

1) Actually, the reason is only one: I don’t want to lose games to Bramble. I mentioned 10 reasons in the subject just to be able to start a new topic and not to be blamed that I didn’t join “Bramble v3” thread. Phew! ☺

2) Mobi is no longer the king of Reaper. I played a few games on Reaper with ST friends. Bramble won them all ☺ I didn't save all the replays, here's just a couple:
http://osn.codepenguin.com/replays/view/...20YtfmLAww
http://osn.codepenguin.com/replays/view/...20Y1fCHAww

You may say that Poweewee is not get used to new Bramby yet, but I’m not a great Bramble player either and have lost my B.vs B. league game:
http://osn.codepenguin.com/replays/view/...20Y2LSJAww
And, BTW, don’t forget that Poweewee is the best player in the world! I know, I know that currently Alvendor is nr1 in the rank. But Poweewee is the best player in the world ☺

3) Mobi now is the only non-combat special which makes it very dangerous to spawn, especially on small maps like SI. Give poor little Mobi ability to bite for 1hp!

4) On the other hand, Brable now can kill any number of units in one turn. All runners, medics and snipers are in danger! Nobody has mentioned that in new-Bramby-blaiming-topics, but this feature is the most contradictive. All types of units in the game can attack only once per turn. All of them! and that was one of the general elements how you could predict your opponents move. You know, that if your opponent has 5 units he can make not more than 5 hits with them. Bramble can make any amount of hits on any amount of units as long as he has enough wits. In one turn! Why is it so?

5) Bramble can kick a unit from any distance. Before that Mobi was the most dangerous and unexpected. But Mobi had his range. Bramble only needs to have enough wits. And killing 1hp unit from any range makes a big difference, especially on a 1-spawn map.

6) Theoretically Bramble alone can kill any unit from any distance. Even when there are not enough opened hexes next to the unit. All you need to do is hit from open hexes, retract parent thorns and repeat the action.

7) As it was already noticed, Bramby is the less elegant unit in the game (not special unit, but among all the units). Actually, he never was elegant with all this complicated parent-child thorns idea. Before Bramby came out you could always read a game just looking at the map. It doesn’t really matter what exactly was made during previous moves, cause you can see current units positions and their hp. But now you need to know what thorn you have to hit if you want to remove that thorn and it forces you to watch the replay and try to remember all the family tree. You can’t read it from map which is strange and boring.

8) But now new Bramby has become even less elegant than it was! Which almost impossible. You can explain all other units in one sentence. And newcomer can understand what the unit does just reading a short description line. But not Bramby! Thorn ratracting, unit hit, family tree, wit-free-actions, child distance. This creature has to go with a full manual: read carefully before use.

9) In 2v2 games me and my partner switched from Mobi+Bombshell to Bramby+Scrambler strategy. Not because we love Bramble very much, but because our old M+B strategy is no longer effective against new Bramby. Mobi is not usefull very much. Bombshell is too turtley without Mobi. It seems that only Scramby has good chances cause he can scramble a thorn and start growing up his own Bramby.

10) That’s not very important, but I think it’s not completely fair when a new update affects games that were already in the progress. We had a couple 2v2 games against Bramble teams and right after the update Bramby killed our units on their very safe positions. We wouldn’t have put that units on that place If we had known about newcoming “surprise” from our developers ☺

[=) Random Task (=]

I very much agree to all your points, burnodrod. I may consider switching to Veggies as well for the very same reasons (even tough I play on a much lower skill level than you).

While everything is debatable in principle and smart brains may yet discover any magic bramble countertactics your point 10 is a particularly valid point, independent of the bramble buff. Changes to the rules of gameplay should not affect games which are already running.

[aaronINdayton]

4. This is incorrect, the problem isn't that bramb can kill any number of units in one turn. The problem is that bramb can spawn units that can spawn units. So, you have bramb and you make a thorn, that's cool. Then your thorn makes a thorn, and that one makes another, and... your out of wits. Next turn bramb and each of the three thorns created last turn make a new thorn. Next turn you have 7 attacking units that can crawl all over the board to get to stuff, eight if bramb makes another thorn! All by only using your actual spawn wit once, and if you keep your thorns safe and weave them together, your unit count of 3 hp 1 attack units grows like crazy. Other teams simply can't keep up with all that unit generation.

9. Try veggies/veggies, I think that's stronger.

[Lenticularis824]

The fact of the matter is the new bramble is not fun unless you're using it. Mobi/bomb was a strong tactic. But even if you noticed it late, there was still a glimmer of hope if your opponent made a mis step. And if he didnt, well you learned from the experience hopefully. As soon as bramble gets going there's no hope for an elegant well played game. And I don't care that the best players can beat it some times, that does not mean its balanced. At midrange it has absolutely ruined the game. It's too strong and too fast and takes too many units and tactics out of the game...

I refuse to use a broken mechanic, and am now sitting games that are not fun to play/impossible to win.

"Try veggies/veggies" how brilliantly appropriate, no other team is worth using atm.

[poweewee]

(03-12-2013 07:49 PM)burnodrod Wrote:  2) Mobi is no longer the king of Reaper. I played a few games on Reaper with ST friends. Bramble won them all ☺ I didn't save all the replays, here's just a couple:
http://osn.codepenguin.com/replays/view/...20YtfmLAww
http://osn.codepenguin.com/replays/view/...20Y1fCHAww

I'll sleep on it, and try to tell you if I find a new strategy as Mobi against the Bramby

(03-12-2013 07:49 PM)burnodrod Wrote:  You may say that Poweewee is not get used to new Bramby yet, but I’m not a great Bramble player either and have lost my B.vs B. league game:
http://osn.codepenguin.com/replays/view/...20Y2LSJAww
And, BTW, don’t forget that Poweewee is the best player in the world! I know, I know that currently Alvendor is nr1 in the rank. But Poweewee is the best player in the world ☺

I didn't pay him to say that.

I promise.

Really.

Seriously though, Alvendor is number 1, and he is there for a reason; he deserves it. I recently lost a game to him, and am in a couple of current games against him. I'll have to beat him in those games if I even want to consider myself number 1

[Norahsul]

Poweewee you have a fan!
Actually more than one!
poweewee is the celebrity of outwitters

[TheGreatErenan]

(03-12-2013 07:49 PM)burnodrod Wrote:  Bramble can make any amount of hits on any amount of units as long as he has enough wits. In one turn! Why is it so?

This isn't true really. You're limited to the number of thorns you already have spawned plus 1. In one turn, each thorn can either spawn a new thorn, prickle, or recede (or get receded automatically when a parent recedes). So you can't, say, save up twenty wits and then attack twenty times. You first have to spawn twenty separate thorns before that's possible, and that requires at least five turns and twenty wits, plus seven to spawn Bramble in the first place, just to get set up for an extremely unlikely twenty HP point mass attack.

[OutwittersFan422]

(03-12-2013 07:49 PM)burnodrod Wrote:  3) Mobi now is the only non-combat special which makes it very dangerous to spawn, especially on small maps like SI. Give poor little Mobi ability to bite for 1hp!

Mobi is still the most versatile special. Movement, attack, defense, yoyo attack, moveable spawn, depresses wit costs, do overs, 2 wit Fog of war recon the list goes on.

Bramble might now have caught up a little but its certainly not there yet

[XtreM Q]

its hard to maneuver mobi around when thorns cover most of the map, and also now its easier to harrass wit hex with bramble than mobi