Reset of leagues

Hamhero · 07-10-2012, 03:26 AM

(07-10-2012 03:14 AM)Szei Wrote: Ugh... Seriously? Won't someone just answer my question?

I don't think anyone knows. I can say that my previously started games haven't counted due to a recurring error. One game that someone forfeited to me was recorded for league ranking.

At worst games aren't being recorded due to reoccurring 'errer'.
I will also say that league play is one of the best features of the game and when it doesn't work correctly it is problematic and effects my enjoyment of the game.

It's an ambitious project from a small team, but maybe it wasn't ready to leave beta.

bspooky · 07-10-2012, 03:27 AM

(07-10-2012 03:21 AM)Szei Wrote: It's not about gaming the ranking system... It's about knowing the answer to a simple question. I have limited time and dont want to start any unnecessary games pas my 5 needed placement matches but I don't know if my current 3 placements i'm playing will count towards placement. It's not a complaint either. I'm fine with the system being reset... I just want to know if I should start a 2 more league games or if I need 5 (because the 3 I'm playing won't count)

I understand wanting to know, as I wouldn't mind knowing either, but does it truly matter. Fast foward to your 16th game....did it really matter if it took you 5, 7, or 8 games to get placed in a league? Trying to figure out the best path to get into a league and starting or not 2 more league games to do that ormjust get to a ranked leaugue asap is gaming the system (I don't mean that derogatorily, it is just applying wits (ha!) to how you go about stuff).

Just play and let it shake out. I think it will track your "league wins" count even from you ranking games anyway, so not sure you would even know 15 games in if it took you 5 or 8 games to get into a league.

digger-04 · (This post was last modified: 07-10-2012 03:32 AM by digger-04.)

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I can understand that and without a certain motivation to win games would be pointless. But does the error in question diminish the entertainment of the game you've spent time playing? Being annoyed about it doesn't help and even if you didn't get points, you gained experience - and based on what you just said, that's what you want in games. Ranking and points is the visible representation of your skill, but getter better at something doesn't need to be reflected to be true.
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I realize being annoyed doesn't physically help anything.

To your experience comment: I am gaining 0 experience playing the type of players I am currently matched up with. Ive lost only 2 or 3 games out of the 30 I've played. One of which was to joseucuervo. There I was able to gain experience. Now I am waiting for 8-10 stalled games, 1 game that says I am not even in the game, and by the time my placement matches are finished I will be at the bottom of the division again, if everything goes the way they say it is supposed to. So currently, I am not entertained. Looking back to last night when I logged those hours I was doing it more for the results and not the entertainment value.

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It's an ambitious project from a small team, but maybe it wasn't ready to leave beta.
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Bingo. When you pay money for something you anticipate that it will work correctly. (I do realize it was free and I invested the money by my own choice.)

***onealexleft*** · 07-10-2012, 03:58 AM

(07-10-2012 02:50 AM)Szei Wrote: Can someone answer me...? I need to know because if my current league matches aren't going to cout I want to start new placements ASAP -.-

The worst of it is over, league matches *will* count.

Szei · 07-10-2012, 04:03 AM

(07-10-2012 03:27 AM)bspooky Wrote:
(07-10-2012 03:21 AM)Szei Wrote: It's not about gaming the ranking system... It's about knowing the answer to a simple question. I have limited time and dont want to start any unnecessary games pas my 5 needed placement matches but I don't know if my current 3 placements i'm playing will count towards placement. It's not a complaint either. I'm fine with the system being reset... I just want to know if I should start a 2 more league games or if I need 5 (because the 3 I'm playing won't count)

I understand wanting to know, as I wouldn't mind knowing either, but does it truly matter. Fast foward to your 16th game....did it really matter if it took you 5, 7, or 8 games to get placed in a league? Trying to figure out the best path to get into a league and starting or not 2 more league games to do that ormjust get to a ranked leaugue asap is gaming the system (I don't mean that derogatorily, it is just applying wits (ha!) to how you go about stuff).

Just play and let it shake out. I think it will track your "league wins" count even from you ranking games anyway, so not sure you would even know 15 games in if it took you 5 or 8 games to get into a league.

You don't understand. You seem to think people only care about league for its prestige factor. I don't. I care about legue because playing opponents of my skill level or slightly higher is more fun because it is a challenge. I'm currently playing friendly games against good players I've met on the forums because it's a nice challenge. I'd like to also be able to play against good random players through league matchmaking too! Crushing new players or bad players in random friendly games or placement league matches isn't fun... This is why I only want to play my 5necessary placement matches and not start anymore league games until I am placed and guaranteed opponents of a certain level. Until I am placed I'd rather focus on friendly games with people I know are good and just stick to my necessary 5 league games. It is NOT gaming the system.

As for not mattering 15 games from now, you're right BUT it does matter now. Think of it this way, will it matter a month from now if you sprain your ankle playing basketball? No. But it does matter right now because you have to rest it for a while and can't enjoy yourself as much until you recover.

yasw · 07-10-2012, 04:37 AM

With a multiplayer game like this, it is clearly important in getting a good start. And I still think they have generally done that very well. The game feels very well tested with balanced gamemechanics and no gamebreaking bugs. Unlike how for example Empire of the Eclipse started out...

Most of the problems is still down to something that can hardly be tested in any betatest, which is players not finishing their games, thus making it take days to just get started in your league. Playing five games would likely be nothing a few weeks from now where the community is more stable, but now it is frustrating because we are still excited about a totally new game and wanna play it alot and taking days to get yourself in a league is a pain.

Maybe some of the problems could have been anticipated and dealt with having fewer days per turn or maybe not even having to do a first ranking and just let everybody start in the middle league and let it play from there. But that is all just hindsight.

Kamikaze28 · 07-10-2012, 04:51 AM

(07-10-2012 04:37 AM)yasw Wrote: With a multiplayer game like this, it is clearly important in getting a good start. And I still think they have generally done that very well. The game feels very well tested with balanced gamemechanics and no gamebreaking bugs. Unlike how for example Empire of the Eclipse started out...

Most of the problems is still down to something that can hardly be tested in any betatest, which is players not finishing their games, thus making it take days to just get started in your league. Playing five games would likely be nothing a few weeks from now where the community is more stable, but now it is frustrating because we are still excited about a totally new game and wanna play it alot and taking days to get yourself in a league is a pain.

Maybe some of the problems could have been anticipated and dealt with having fewer days per turn or maybe not even having to do a first ranking and just let everybody start in the middle league and let it play from there. But that is all just hindsight.

That's a very reasonable assessment of the situation. More often than once the phrase "we can't test this with our limited player pool" was uttered in the beta forums. The limitation on beta testers wasn't even OMLs fault, but Apple policy - you only have 100 slots to give away and if you look into the credits, there are 55 beta testers listed and a 11 local testers. There were certainly some friends and family beta testers too. I'd say, they made the most of what they had.

Szei · (This post was last modified: 07-10-2012 05:28 AM by Szei.)

(07-10-2012 03:58 AM)onealexleft Wrote:
(07-10-2012 02:50 AM)Szei Wrote: Can someone answer me...? I need to know because if my current league matches aren't going to cout I want to start new placements ASAP -.-

The worst of it is over, league matches *will* count.

=/ Well, I just won another placement game a few minutes ago and it still says 5 of 5 remaining. Oh well.

I just want to get through my placements already and start playing players of my skill level but I think yasw brings up a good point. In a couple weeks when the flood of new players dies down it will be much easier to get through placements without having people stop playing midway through and slowing things down. For now though it's a real pain because every league game you start as you try to place runs the risk of turning into a dead game and clogging up your 20 game limit =(

I've started 10 league placement games so far. 5 are dead and 4 I won (1 game is still active). With the reset I still need to win 5 more though apparently. I just hope I can get through them without incurring too many more dead games since 1/4th of my slots are already dead and I've made no progress towards placing yet.

bspooky · (This post was last modified: 07-10-2012 05:52 AM by bspooky.)

(07-10-2012 04:03 AM)Szei Wrote: As for not mattering 15 games from now, you're right BUT it does matter now. Think of it this way, will it matter a month from now if you sprain your ankle playing basketball? No. But it does matter right now because you have to rest it for a while and can't enjoy yourself as much until you recover.

Going with your analogy, do you not go down that hill since you may sprain your ankle, or do you have fun going down the hill anyway? Ok, that doesn't work. ;-) Basically, wouldn't electing to play a few (2-3 in your particular case if I remember correctly) more ranking games be less hassle/stress/worrying that figuring out how to avoid potentially playing bad players? If you get matched with bad players, the games will go quick and not be too painful. If you get matched with players of your level, then great, that is what you wanted anyway.

But hey, you may not agree and think 1-3 of your 2-5 extra games against bad players would be too onerous. That is valid too depending on your viewpoint. It just seemed like there may be a trend of not playing for the little while it takes to get this fixed and that seemed like a shame, especially to those of us that want to play. Big Grin

***onealexleft*** · 07-10-2012, 05:46 AM

(07-10-2012 04:37 AM)yasw Wrote: With a multiplayer game like this, it is clearly important in getting a good start. And I still think they have generally done that very well. The game feels very well tested with balanced gamemechanics and no gamebreaking bugs. Unlike how for example Empire of the Eclipse started out...

Most of the problems is still down to something that can hardly be tested in any betatest, which is players not finishing their games, thus making it take days to just get started in your league. Playing five games would likely be nothing a few weeks from now where the community is more stable, but now it is frustrating because we are still excited about a totally new game and wanna play it alot and taking days to get yourself in a league is a pain.

Maybe some of the problems could have been anticipated and dealt with having fewer days per turn or maybe not even having to do a first ranking and just let everybody start in the middle league and let it play from there. But that is all just hindsight.

One of the biggest challenges we're facing right now is anticipating how it all works with 10s of thousands of users. This largely stems from not being able to host a large beta stress test (due to limitations of iOS). While we're trying to fix things as quickly as possible, there are some 'unknown unknowns' we're running into that takes a bit more time to analyze, assess, and fix.

We've fixed most of the problems occurring right now involving league games not counting, but there are a few edge cases to about 1% of our users. Any *new* league game for those set of users will work, while the old ones may have some stragglers that refuse to count.

Thanks for your patience!