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amoffett11 · (This post was last modified: 03-22-2013 12:59 PM by amoffett11.)

(03-22-2013 10:00 AM)worldfamous Wrote:
(03-22-2013 07:43 AM)amoffett Wrote:
(03-22-2013 07:02 AM)worldfamous Wrote:
(03-22-2013 04:09 AM)GreatGonzales Wrote:
(03-22-2013 04:01 AM)amoffett Wrote: Weren't you guys arguing though that you felt you were about as good as they were? If that were true, it would only have been a matter of time.

so basically a bunch of ST-quality teams were eating each other and no one could climb high enough to reach the bar.
Well said. That's exactly what was happening.

Except for a couple of teams did reach the bar.

You can't have it both ways, you can't a) be as good as them and b) not get up to their skill rating eventually. So which is it?
It seems you're just being antagonistic. I think you're just not understanding that 2v2 and 1v1 are different worlds. Adam and Alex took a second look, realized as much, and adjusted. If it makes you feel any better, it's definitely not as satisfying reaching ST the way we did.

I'm not trying to be antagonistic. However, I really don't understand where youre coming from when you say that "I don't understand that 1v1 and 2v2 are different worlds", when that's all I've been saying since the beginning, by saying that 1v1 numbers and statistics should not be applied to 2v2.

(03-22-2013 08:19 AM)GreatGonzales Wrote:
(03-22-2013 07:43 AM)amoffett Wrote: You can't have it both ways, you can't a) be as good as them and b) not get up to their skill rating eventually. So which is it?

Neither A or B actually... Not saying we (those that are newly ST) are as good as the two pre-existing STs. Saying we are almost as good, good enough to deserve to be in the highest league. Also not saying that we are at "their" skill rating; we are ST because we have surpassed a point threshold that has been lowered, not the old threshold which was more excluding. You seem to have a misunderstanding about how ranking systems work; it's not as though people can go up in score indefinitely. There's a limit to how far one can increase in skill rating/points that is in part dependent upon the number of players in the population. The old threshold was too high for the size of the player population, so OML adjusted it and now we're ST. A good way to think of it is this: you can only climb as high as there are people below you. Not a perfect analogy but you get the idea.

But new people are playing Outwitters all the time, as well as new teams of existing players adding to the 2v2 pool. The size of the population is growing all the time. Therefore, if your analogy is correct, you would've become a supertitan by waiting it out a bit(and by continuing to win a bunch though that goes without saying).

As far as how ranking systems work, the number of super titans is independent of the number of players in the population. It depends only on the skill distribution of the players. Because of the matchmaking system, there is a maximum number of supertitans, but there is no minimum. For example, if everyone played everyone 50/50, there would no supertitans. If one team won 90% of the time, and the others all won 50% of the time, you'd have one ST. This is the case whether there's 10 players or 1000s.

Here's an interesting thought: imagine that everyone was awesome at 2v2. Or that the only people who ever played were just the top 40 teams. You'd all probably be in gifted or clever league (except for the current STs, based on their W/L they'd still probably be STs). It's not about how many players there are, but how many are below you in skill (below you in skill so that you can beat them). The reason none of you became STs as quickly as the other teams is because you all played each other so evenly. Imagine a population of 50 players. One team beats everyone else: they are a ST, because they are better than 49 teams. One team loses every game: they are fluffy, because they are better than 0 teams. The other 48 teams play each other evenly: they are all in clever (maybe not even there) because there is only one team worse than all of them. If you are even with a team, they are not worse than you. This is what happened more or less with the old threshold, so many of you were even towards the top, that there weren't enough players below you for you to advance. Now the threshold is lower, so less 'lower' players are required. This is why I doubt that OML will find a threshold to give you the percentage you're after, it's like splitting an atom, you guys are too close together.