Veggienauts Bramble - Suggested improvements to initial beta version

Jack•Sparrow · 10-04-2012, 12:33 PM

(10-04-2012 10:32 AM)Demonwind66 Wrote: Also, what are the rules for growing? Can it only cover 1 additional hex per turn?

I don't really want to give away specifics (because it's still in beta for a reason; that is, it's subject to change where needed) however, I will say that you can (for 1 wit cost) bramble a hex from the core, and/or from an established bramble hex. So turn 1 (from when you build/buy? your bramble) you place a bramble, turn two you can grow 2 (for 1 Wit each), turn three you can grow 4 more, so you can have 7 brambles on the field within three turns of making your super.

Demon · 10-04-2012, 01:11 PM

But they still cost one apiece, so that's a huge wit investment anyways. Not impressed, but I haven't actually played it. Maybe the final version will be worthwhile, I'll at least check it out.

ArtNJ · 10-04-2012, 09:34 PM

(10-04-2012 01:11 PM)Demonwind66 Wrote: But they still cost one apiece, so that's a huge wit investment anyways. Not impressed, but I haven't actually played it. Maybe the final version will be worthwhile, I'll at least check it out.

I dont know that anyone is impressed with the gameplay impact yet. Its a cool idea, it just needs tweaking.

Ravernoth · (This post was last modified: 10-04-2012 09:49 PM by Ravernoth.)

(10-04-2012 12:33 PM)Jack•Sparrow Wrote:
(10-04-2012 10:32 AM)Demonwind66 Wrote: Also, what are the rules for growing? Can it only cover 1 additional hex per turn?

I don't really want to give away specifics (because it's still in beta for a reason; that is, it's subject to change where needed) however, I will say that you can (for 1 wit cost) bramble a hex from the core, and/or from an established bramble hex. So turn 1 (from when you build/buy? your bramble) you place a bramble, turn two you can grow 2 (for 1 Wit each), turn three you can grow 4 more, so you can have 7 brambles on the field within three turns of making your super.

The problem is the thorns themselves are not worth the cost, it takes too long to build up range, and it lacks impact on offense.

Hence my recommendation of giving it range from the beginning, and giving thorns the ability to attack for 1 damage.

However this would be limited to 1 thorn per turn - it would be overpowered if you could create multiple.

ArtNJ · 10-05-2012, 12:13 AM

I dunno, the thorns might be worth one wit as is if you could build more, more quickly, with a more modest sunk cost. The sunk cost of 9 is just insanely too high for what it does. 7, + move +root, = 9 just to get started. That is a non-starter without serious improvements in the thorns. However, if the sunk cost were reduced, more modest improvements in the thorns might be ok.

Ravernoth · 10-05-2012, 12:49 AM

(10-05-2012 12:13 AM)ArtNJ Wrote: I dunno, the thorns might be worth one wit as is if you could build more, more quickly, with a more modest sunk cost. The sunk cost of 9 is just insanely too high for what it does. 7, + move +root, = 9 just to get started. That is a non-starter without serious improvements in the thorns. However, if the sunk cost were reduced, more modest improvements in the thorns might be ok.

Ah, I forgot that it required rooting. Thats a further knock against it. I've edited the original post to suggest this be removed.

Demon · 10-05-2012, 01:12 AM

Maybe if (once rooted) instead of growing one hex it could grow three (still for 1 wit)? It would create a greater impact faster and doesn't seem too overpowered, since the thorns only have 1 health. The 3 would have to be in a straight line from the bramble or existing thorns.

**Harti** · 10-05-2012, 02:10 AM

(10-05-2012 12:13 AM)ArtNJ Wrote: 7, + move +root, = 9 just to get started.

I have no idea how often I've mentioned that already but rooting is still, intentionally, free Big Grin

Ravernoth · (This post was last modified: 10-05-2012 02:34 AM by Ravernoth.)

(10-05-2012 02:10 AM)Harti Wrote:
(10-05-2012 12:13 AM)ArtNJ Wrote: 7, + move +root, = 9 just to get started.
I have no idea how often I've mentioned that already but rooting is still, intentionally, free

Ah good to know.. thanks for the correction Smile

bmike · (This post was last modified: 10-05-2012 05:45 AM by bmike.)

(10-05-2012 02:10 AM)Harti Wrote:
(10-05-2012 12:13 AM)ArtNJ Wrote: 7, + move +root, = 9 just to get started.
I have no idea how often I've mentioned that already but rooting is still, intentionally, free

This is going to be interesting to compare to the shell.

shell "root" - not free
shell "unroot" - not free
shooting shell scrambled - unshells if the shell isn't a partner in 2v2
(OP must use a wit to shell and can't shoot that turn. If you scramble a 2v2 partner's shell it loses health but is still shelled and can fire)

bramble "root" - free
bramble "unroot" - free ?? haven't tested
bramble scramble - unroots (but less of a penalty since the OP can root it for no wits - can push thorns that turn for a wit)