Have you ever played Hero Academy?

[stevewastaken]

On the Undo feature:

Undo is not the problem. It's actually a partial fix to a problem. The problem is that the fix is only partial. So Undo lets you try a million different attacks to your heart's content, and you never have to do any math, and that's great. What Undo can't show you is what your opponent can do on his turn.

So once you have a few possible attacks that look like good possibilities, you have to break out a calculator and do the math on every possible counter attack. Then Undo, try your next possibility, then do the math on every possible counter to THAT one. So on, and so on. It takes a lot of time, and isn't fun. When 1 game can last 80 turns sometimes, it can get tedious just to achieve 1 win. Not to mention the developers continue to add more and more complexities to the math. By the time I quit, each turn began to feel like homework.

On TF2:

I actually quit HA because of TF2. Sure HA was getting a little old, and Outwitters was about to come out, but it was the announcement of the TF2 team that really drove me away. It completely destroys the world of the game. Gameplay is not just balance and stats. It's the player's experience with a game. This includes other elements, like artwork, and world immersion. For me, the gameplay was irreparably damaged.

(08-10-2012 03:38 AM)GreatGonzales Wrote:  Perhaps I would feel differently if I was a TF2 fan, but alas, I have never played the game. I should give it a try I guess...I do own the Orange Box.

Nah, I was a hardcore TFC player back in the day. I also played TF2 and thought it was pretty decent. That doesn't help my feelings about the TF2 team being in HA though.

Outwitters vs. HA:

There are a few things I like a little better about HA. The animations are smoother in HA. Cheating and bugs aren't as much of an issue in HA. The player run league (no thanks to the HA developers) figured out how to negate FTA.

Other than these things, Outwitters is a better game in about every possible way. For example, it makes me giggle a little when people complain about not being able to remember what happened earlier in an Outwitters game. First of all, there is replay. Go back 1 turn and watch. Second, try HA. You might have a brain aneurism trying to remember what happened earlier in an HA game.

[worldfamous]

(08-14-2012 10:21 AM)stevewastaken Wrote:  I actually quit HA because of TF2. Sure HA was getting a little old, and Outwitters was about to come out, but it was the announcement of the TF2 team that really drove me away. It completely destroys the world of the game. Gameplay is not just balance and stats. It's the player's experience with a game. This includes other elements, like artwork, and world immersion. For me, the gameplay was irreparably damaged.

I just can't wrap my head around that line of thought. If the game is fun, why is a new skin so detrimental? I understand if you're frustrated over the whole Steam issue, but I just fail to see how a new skin can ruin a game for you. It's not as if there's some deep back story, or any story for that matter. Maybe if it was an RPG I could relate. If people quit playing WoW because a Star Wars team was introduced, I'd get that. The way I see it, quitting HA because of TF2, is analogous to quitting Chess because the pieces were blue and red instead of black and white. Outwitters has teddy bears, robots, and walking sea creatures. How do you justify that? I am just truly baffled. Please enlighten me.

P.S. So far the TF2 team sucks. I haven't played HA since Outwitters launched, so it's possible I'm just rusty. I'm playing a friend of mine that I normally beat 9/10. I'm using the TF2 team against each of the other teams and I can't get close in any of them. Way too squishy and the sniper is useless unless he's on a sword tile, medic boosted, and an opponent dumb enough to stand in his row. I must say though, they are fun to lose with.

[stevewastaken]

I have no issue with Steam. It's a new market to sell their game on, good for them.

But just because a world is not explained in depth with a backstory, doesn't mean it isn't there or isn't important. TF2 is not just a skin (skins can usually be turned off, or are only around for a limited time), they are a full legitimate team. The teams in HA are the majority of what make up the world. So when the teams go Fantasy Humans, Elves, Dwarves, Orcs, Austrailian Man with a Sniper rifle, there is a blatant inconsistency with what was being done. It doesn't help that the reason that inconsistency comes is purely an advertizement.

Outwitters is wacky, and that is the world of Outwitters. It's easier to stay true to a wacky world than it is a fantasy world because the rules and limitations of a wacky world are not as clearly defined. Yet still I do hope Adam and Alex stay consistent in the wacky world they have created thus far.

[GreatGonzales]

I hear ya steve. I am also turned off by TF2 for the reasons you mention. But I'll probably go ahead and purchase the new team at some point... For now, I am focusing on Outwitters.

[Amateur6]

Just to to throw in my 2¢ —

I played HA, found Outwitters, and promptly dumped HA. I don’t think the "tutorial" (whatever they call them) battles were enough to get the hang of the teams, and I just plain got sick of playing against more experienced players (and yes, getting my @ss handed to me).

Go Outwitters! <3

[CombatEX]

(08-14-2012 10:21 AM)stevewastaken Wrote:  I actually quit HA because of TF2. Sure HA was getting a little old, and Outwitters was about to come out, but it was the announcement of the TF2 team that really drove me away. It completely destroys the world of the game. Gameplay is not just balance and stats. It's the player's experience with a game. This includes other elements, like artwork, and world immersion. For me, the gameplay was irreparably damaged.

I agree completely. Just when I was starting to warm up to HA the TF2 team comes in to completely ruin the aesthetic... which was one of the main selling points for me over Outwitters. Though I've come to terms with the Adorables, I initially found them disagreeable to me in a war game coming from things like AoE, SC2, WC3, etc. I'd still prefer them to have a more serious skin, but it's okay because while the Adorables are considered a 'joke' team (as OML put it in one of their posts), at least the Feedback and Scallywags don't take themselves too seriously either. As a result the Adorables don't really break the aesthetic in Outwitters - I just prefer the HA aesthetic. However now it's ruined with the TF2 team =/

All that aside I prefer Outwitter's gameplay anyway as I like having full control over my unit production. So in other words, the TF2 team alone isn't stopping me from playing HA, but rather is the final straw that pushes me away from it.

[Plasmaexe]

Kinda new to iOs games and stuff so this was one of the games I tried along with Outwitters and it's pretty fun. I'm happy to win my first game against a Shaolin team by breaking the crystals and almost getting wiped out completely. I'm trying to decide what teams I should buy since I'm probably not going to be buying all of them and I have $5 left on my itunes account (the council team you can use is still pretty good though). I'm assuming Team Fortress is a PC exclusive? Cause i don't see it in the shop.

The game could really use a save replay function to learn what went right and wrong after a match, that's kind of a big gripe I have, along with some sort of balancing mechanic to make up for not having the first turn. A ranking option would also be nice to match you up with less experienced people. I'll probably buy a team or two, but I don't really know which I should get. I do have some mixed thoughts about being able to redo moves though, at least in the long run when I'm more experienced with the game. Starting off it does make the game a lot more accessible though.

[brioriy]

Is it still playable? Like, is there a community and a player base to start playing?

[ElPared]

I hated Hero Academy. I could never get any of the units to work the way they were supposed to and it's too easy to move something on accident and waste one of your precious 5 movements or whatever. It also seems much more luck based than Outwitters because of the little bar thing that gives you your units/items randomly and I tend to hate any non-card game with that kind of luck element in it.

Outwitters makes way more sense to me and has a much better interface and controls and rewards strong strategy and risk management. That's why I love it