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+--- Thread: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent (/showthread.php?tid=3330)
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - lawtai - 03-28-2014 06:01 AM
(03-28-2014 05:25 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote: On 3-wit boards it's the opposite though, so it evens out.
What 3-wit maps?
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - Flarp55 - 03-28-2014 06:07 AM
sorry, meant 2...
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - ElPared - 03-28-2014 07:13 AM
(03-28-2014 05:25 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote:(03-27-2014 04:05 PM)ElPared Wrote: I notice FTA the most on Peekaboo where I can't see anything my opponent did until it's too late and they're in a position to kill your stuff for free, especially against adorables where they can save their runner or whatever and get a unit advantage.
As far as quitting before I get an opponent, I admit I do this. When I get Thorn Gulley as Feedback I always give up if I'm player 1. That's such a frustratingly bad map for Feedback that I refuse to play on it as them if I don't have to. I also do it if I screw up my opening move somehow, like I forget to cap a wit space or something.
I actually rather like that this can be done, and I don't consider it cheating so much as poor sportsmanship. In Thorn Gulley's case, though, I couldn't give 2 sh*ts about sportsmanship.
I think that this is cheating because it gives you a higher chance if winning. Say you win 50% of the time except on TG, where you win 0% of the time. Then your win probability goes up from 45.5% up to 50%. Even though the probability only goes up a little, it is still cheating. You could take this to the extreme by quitting every time unless you get glitch, where Feedback has a strong advantage.
Regardless, that is how the game works and until it is fixed or in some other capacity officially declared cheating, I will continue to do it until I figure out a good strategy for Thorn Gulley as Player 2.
speaking of which, your example only included games where I'm P1, so the "advantage" I gain by doing this is actually more like +2% which is effectively meaningless. Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even, so I don't see how a 52% chance makes that much difference, especially when there's no skill involved in coin flipping.
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - Flarp55 - 03-28-2014 07:52 AM
(03-28-2014 07:13 AM)ElPared Wrote:(03-28-2014 05:25 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote:(03-27-2014 04:05 PM)ElPared Wrote: I notice FTA the most on Peekaboo where I can't see anything my opponent did until it's too late and they're in a position to kill your stuff for free, especially against adorables where they can save their runner or whatever and get a unit advantage.
As far as quitting before I get an opponent, I admit I do this. When I get Thorn Gulley as Feedback I always give up if I'm player 1. That's such a frustratingly bad map for Feedback that I refuse to play on it as them if I don't have to. I also do it if I screw up my opening move somehow, like I forget to cap a wit space or something.
I actually rather like that this can be done, and I don't consider it cheating so much as poor sportsmanship. In Thorn Gulley's case, though, I couldn't give 2 sh*ts about sportsmanship.
I think that this is cheating because it gives you a higher chance if winning. Say you win 50% of the time except on TG, where you win 0% of the time. Then your win probability goes up from 45.5% up to 50%. Even though the probability only goes up a little, it is still cheating. You could take this to the extreme by quitting every time unless you get glitch, where Feedback has a strong advantage.
Regardless, that is how the game works and until it is fixed or in some other capacity officially declared cheating, I will continue to do it until I figure out a good strategy for Thorn Gulley as Player 2.
speaking of which, your example only included games where I'm P1, so the "advantage" I gain by doing this is actually more like +2% which is effectively meaningless. Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even, so I don't see how a 52% chance makes that much difference, especially when there's no skill involved in coin flipping.
It's still artificially increasing your win probability.
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - game_taker - 03-28-2014 08:27 AM
(03-28-2014 07:13 AM)ElPared Wrote: Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even...
Before anyone starts spreading this rumour more I'd like to point out that it is not true. "[Coin flips] are closer to 51/49, biased toward whatever side was up when the coin was thrown into the air."
Reference some article in smithsonian/science about coin flips
Also in regards to why FTA no longer exists it is discussed in the following Thread about FTA. (In reality their is still a bit of FTA, on foundry as I already mentioned, and in the fact that P1 has potential to have +1 more unit then P2 for end of all P1 moves.)
Edit
Why FTA is not a strategy --
Advantage as oppose to Strategy . FTA in foundry exists b/c P1 can create an opening on turn 2 such that P2 cannot defend both his medic and sniper. This is an FTA b/c (First turn) P2 cannot do the same, (Advantage) b/c Medic + sniper in foundry are crucial for winning. This is not a strategy b/c it is the it is the initial position of units that allow the situation to exist. HOWEVER the fact that P1 chooses to take advantage of this FTA is, I'm willing to agree, a type of strategy since P1 choose this type of plan to execute.
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - jchris98 - 03-28-2014 08:29 AM
(03-28-2014 07:13 AM)ElPared Wrote:(03-28-2014 05:25 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote:(03-27-2014 04:05 PM)ElPared Wrote: I notice FTA the most on Peekaboo where I can't see anything my opponent did until it's too late and they're in a position to kill your stuff for free, especially against adorables where they can save their runner or whatever and get a unit advantage.
As far as quitting before I get an opponent, I admit I do this. When I get Thorn Gulley as Feedback I always give up if I'm player 1. That's such a frustratingly bad map for Feedback that I refuse to play on it as them if I don't have to. I also do it if I screw up my opening move somehow, like I forget to cap a wit space or something.
I actually rather like that this can be done, and I don't consider it cheating so much as poor sportsmanship. In Thorn Gulley's case, though, I couldn't give 2 sh*ts about sportsmanship.
I think that this is cheating because it gives you a higher chance if winning. Say you win 50% of the time except on TG, where you win 0% of the time. Then your win probability goes up from 45.5% up to 50%. Even though the probability only goes up a little, it is still cheating. You could take this to the extreme by quitting every time unless you get glitch, where Feedback has a strong advantage.
Regardless, that is how the game works and until it is fixed or in some other capacity officially declared cheating, I will continue to do it until I figure out a good strategy for Thorn Gulley as Player 2.
speaking of which, your example only included games where I'm P1, so the "advantage" I gain by doing this is actually more like +2% which is effectively meaningless. Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even, so I don't see how a 52% chance makes that much difference, especially when there's no skill involved in coin flipping.
If we are handing out 2% win increase, I'll take one.
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - Chemoeum - 03-28-2014 08:44 AM
(03-28-2014 08:29 AM)jchris98 Wrote:+2(03-28-2014 07:13 AM)ElPared Wrote:(03-28-2014 05:25 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote:(03-27-2014 04:05 PM)ElPared Wrote: I notice FTA the most on Peekaboo where I can't see anything my opponent did until it's too late and they're in a position to kill your stuff for free, especially against adorables where they can save their runner or whatever and get a unit advantage.
As far as quitting before I get an opponent, I admit I do this. When I get Thorn Gulley as Feedback I always give up if I'm player 1. That's such a frustratingly bad map for Feedback that I refuse to play on it as them if I don't have to. I also do it if I screw up my opening move somehow, like I forget to cap a wit space or something.
I actually rather like that this can be done, and I don't consider it cheating so much as poor sportsmanship. In Thorn Gulley's case, though, I couldn't give 2 sh*ts about sportsmanship.
I think that this is cheating because it gives you a higher chance if winning. Say you win 50% of the time except on TG, where you win 0% of the time. Then your win probability goes up from 45.5% up to 50%. Even though the probability only goes up a little, it is still cheating. You could take this to the extreme by quitting every time unless you get glitch, where Feedback has a strong advantage.
Regardless, that is how the game works and until it is fixed or in some other capacity officially declared cheating, I will continue to do it until I figure out a good strategy for Thorn Gulley as Player 2.
speaking of which, your example only included games where I'm P1, so the "advantage" I gain by doing this is actually more like +2% which is effectively meaningless. Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even, so I don't see how a 52% chance makes that much difference, especially when there's no skill involved in coin flipping.
If we are handing out 2% win increase, I'll take one.
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - Flarp55 - 03-28-2014 08:47 AM
(03-28-2014 08:44 AM)Chemoeum Wrote:(03-28-2014 08:29 AM)jchris98 Wrote:+2(03-28-2014 07:13 AM)ElPared Wrote:(03-28-2014 05:25 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote:(03-27-2014 04:05 PM)ElPared Wrote: I notice FTA the most on Peekaboo where I can't see anything my opponent did until it's too late and they're in a position to kill your stuff for free, especially against adorables where they can save their runner or whatever and get a unit advantage.
As far as quitting before I get an opponent, I admit I do this. When I get Thorn Gulley as Feedback I always give up if I'm player 1. That's such a frustratingly bad map for Feedback that I refuse to play on it as them if I don't have to. I also do it if I screw up my opening move somehow, like I forget to cap a wit space or something.
I actually rather like that this can be done, and I don't consider it cheating so much as poor sportsmanship. In Thorn Gulley's case, though, I couldn't give 2 sh*ts about sportsmanship.
I think that this is cheating because it gives you a higher chance if winning. Say you win 50% of the time except on TG, where you win 0% of the time. Then your win probability goes up from 45.5% up to 50%. Even though the probability only goes up a little, it is still cheating. You could take this to the extreme by quitting every time unless you get glitch, where Feedback has a strong advantage.
Regardless, that is how the game works and until it is fixed or in some other capacity officially declared cheating, I will continue to do it until I figure out a good strategy for Thorn Gulley as Player 2.
speaking of which, your example only included games where I'm P1, so the "advantage" I gain by doing this is actually more like +2% which is effectively meaningless. Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even, so I don't see how a 52% chance makes that much difference, especially when there's no skill involved in coin flipping.
If we are handing out 2% win increase, I'll take one.
Do you mean +2% ?
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - Chemoeum - 03-28-2014 08:49 AM
(03-28-2014 08:47 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote:(03-28-2014 08:44 AM)Chemoeum Wrote:(03-28-2014 08:29 AM)jchris98 Wrote:+2(03-28-2014 07:13 AM)ElPared Wrote:(03-28-2014 05:25 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote: I think that this is cheating because it gives you a higher chance if winning. Say you win 50% of the time except on TG, where you win 0% of the time. Then your win probability goes up from 45.5% up to 50%. Even though the probability only goes up a little, it is still cheating. You could take this to the extreme by quitting every time unless you get glitch, where Feedback has a strong advantage.
Regardless, that is how the game works and until it is fixed or in some other capacity officially declared cheating, I will continue to do it until I figure out a good strategy for Thorn Gulley as Player 2.
speaking of which, your example only included games where I'm P1, so the "advantage" I gain by doing this is actually more like +2% which is effectively meaningless. Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even, so I don't see how a 52% chance makes that much difference, especially when there's no skill involved in coin flipping.
If we are handing out 2% win increase, I'll take one.
Do you mean +2% ?
+2 rep
RE: Giving Up Before You Get An Opponent - Flarp55 - 03-28-2014 08:52 AM
(03-28-2014 08:49 AM)Chemoeum Wrote:(03-28-2014 08:47 AM)Bbobb555 Wrote:(03-28-2014 08:44 AM)Chemoeum Wrote:(03-28-2014 08:29 AM)jchris98 Wrote:+2(03-28-2014 07:13 AM)ElPared Wrote: Regardless, that is how the game works and until it is fixed or in some other capacity officially declared cheating, I will continue to do it until I figure out a good strategy for Thorn Gulley as Player 2.
speaking of which, your example only included games where I'm P1, so the "advantage" I gain by doing this is actually more like +2% which is effectively meaningless. Coin flips have a 51% chance to come up tails but we still call them even, so I don't see how a 52% chance makes that much difference, especially when there's no skill involved in coin flipping.
If we are handing out 2% win increase, I'll take one.
Do you mean +2% ?
+2 rep
but he also gets +2%